Few people support the strikers. Even the NHS have little if no support for strike action.
Deliver the goods or **** off and find another job seems to be the general consensus. I agree with that wholeheartedly.
Winter of Discontent (202)2
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Few people support the strikers. Even the NHS have little if no support for strike action.
Deliver the goods or **** off and find another job seems to be the general consensus. I agree with that wholeheartedly.
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QuIte a lot have done that, from the NHS. That's part of the problem. There's a huge turnover of staff. The consensus hasn't been working.
Most people support the NHS strikes
Britain backs the nurses as poll shows 54% support strike action over pay
A survey conducted for the Mirror by Redfield and Wilton found 54% support nurses striking over their demand for an above inflation pay rise, with only 23% against
www.mirror.co.uk
RMT.goes the other way.
Britons tend to oppose planned RMT rail strikes this winter | YouGov
They do, however, support rail workers refusing overtime over the festive period
yougov.co.uk
41% support, 47% oppose. Most people do not support the strikes but millions do.
You're out of touch filly
There are people like motorbiking trying to spread the false rumour that the rail strike is by greedy overpaid train drivers.
Quite a lot of people have been tricked into believing it.
Meanwhile, Gone and his ilk want the government to set pay scales for ordinary working people.
In this case, the government is attempting to prolong the rail strike by imposing additional demands.
Quite a lot of people have been tricked into believing it.
Meanwhile, Gone and his ilk want the government to set pay scales for ordinary working people.
In this case, the government is attempting to prolong the rail strike by imposing additional demands.
Letting inflation reduce real wages while expecting services to be maintained is dishonest
MARTIN WOLF
FT.com
"Since the Conservatives won power in May 2010, overall real average pay (including bonuses) had risen by 5.5 per cent in the private sector by September 2022, but fallen by 5.9 per cent in the public sector. Startlingly, between January 2021 and September 2022, average real pay in the private sector fell by 1.5 per cent, but in the public sector pay fell by 7.7 per cent. In fact, all the decline in real public sector pay since 2010 has occurred in the past two years."
"Yet even if some fall in real earnings in the economy makes sense, why should the public sector’s fall be far greater than that in the private sector?
One might argue that control over public sector wages is an effective way to prevent a wage-price spiral, that government cannot afford to pay public sector workers any more, or that inflation is an opportunity to reduce excessive levels of public sector pay, especially when one takes perks, notably generous pensions, into account.
None of these arguments has merit."
"On the first, Ben Zaranko of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, notes that “it is difficult to see how an increase in public sector wages could directly contribute to a wage-price spiral”, given the lack of prices in the public sector. Nor, he notes, can one argue that public sector pay is leading inflation, since it is falling far behind. Above all, policy on pay will not lower inflation. This demands macroeconomic measures."
"On the second, the decision by government not to raise pay in line with wages in the private sector is not because it cannot afford to do so. Taxes could be raised if the will were there. It is in effect a political decision to make public sector employees pay for the government’s unfunded promises.
On the last argument, as the IFS noted in its October 2022 Green Budget, average pay in the public sector is higher than in the private sector, but this advantage disappears when one takes worker characteristics — age, experience, qualifications and so forth — into account. Public sector workers are then paid slightly less than private sector ones. In fact, the ratio is now more unfavourable to public sector workers than at any point in the past 30 years. True, if one considers employer pension contributions as well, public sector employees were paid 6 per cent more than private sector ones on average in 2021. But this slight advantage is sure to erode further in 2022."
"Above all, the test of whether pay is appropriate is whether it maintains services at the levels government has promised. It is clear that there are substantial shortfalls in key staff, as well as widespread concerns about their quality. Thus, data from NHS England “show a vacancy rate of 11.9 per cent as at September 30 2022 within the Registered Nursing staff group (47,496 vacancies). This is an increase from the same period in the previous year, when the vacancy rate was 10.5 per cent (39,931 vacancies).” Again, data show dramatic shortfalls in recruitment of teachers in such subjects as physics or design & technology."
"As Chris Cook argues, the government should ask whether public sector pay is at a level that will sustain delivery of needed services. The country’s social fabric is fraying. In particular, ill health is damaging labour supply. If the government is not prepared to raise the required taxes, it should be honest about that. Letting inflation reduce real pay, while expecting services to be maintained, let alone improve, is plainly dishonest.
The government should keep pay in line with the private sector’s, especially where it has significant recruitment and retention problems. If this means it has to reopen spending plans that no longer make sense in today’s debased pounds, so be it. What is happening now may be penny-wise, but it is pound-foolish."
MARTIN WOLF
FT.com
"Since the Conservatives won power in May 2010, overall real average pay (including bonuses) had risen by 5.5 per cent in the private sector by September 2022, but fallen by 5.9 per cent in the public sector. Startlingly, between January 2021 and September 2022, average real pay in the private sector fell by 1.5 per cent, but in the public sector pay fell by 7.7 per cent. In fact, all the decline in real public sector pay since 2010 has occurred in the past two years."
"Yet even if some fall in real earnings in the economy makes sense, why should the public sector’s fall be far greater than that in the private sector?
One might argue that control over public sector wages is an effective way to prevent a wage-price spiral, that government cannot afford to pay public sector workers any more, or that inflation is an opportunity to reduce excessive levels of public sector pay, especially when one takes perks, notably generous pensions, into account.
None of these arguments has merit."
"On the first, Ben Zaranko of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, notes that “it is difficult to see how an increase in public sector wages could directly contribute to a wage-price spiral”, given the lack of prices in the public sector. Nor, he notes, can one argue that public sector pay is leading inflation, since it is falling far behind. Above all, policy on pay will not lower inflation. This demands macroeconomic measures."
"On the second, the decision by government not to raise pay in line with wages in the private sector is not because it cannot afford to do so. Taxes could be raised if the will were there. It is in effect a political decision to make public sector employees pay for the government’s unfunded promises.
On the last argument, as the IFS noted in its October 2022 Green Budget, average pay in the public sector is higher than in the private sector, but this advantage disappears when one takes worker characteristics — age, experience, qualifications and so forth — into account. Public sector workers are then paid slightly less than private sector ones. In fact, the ratio is now more unfavourable to public sector workers than at any point in the past 30 years. True, if one considers employer pension contributions as well, public sector employees were paid 6 per cent more than private sector ones on average in 2021. But this slight advantage is sure to erode further in 2022."
"Above all, the test of whether pay is appropriate is whether it maintains services at the levels government has promised. It is clear that there are substantial shortfalls in key staff, as well as widespread concerns about their quality. Thus, data from NHS England “show a vacancy rate of 11.9 per cent as at September 30 2022 within the Registered Nursing staff group (47,496 vacancies). This is an increase from the same period in the previous year, when the vacancy rate was 10.5 per cent (39,931 vacancies).” Again, data show dramatic shortfalls in recruitment of teachers in such subjects as physics or design & technology."
"As Chris Cook argues, the government should ask whether public sector pay is at a level that will sustain delivery of needed services. The country’s social fabric is fraying. In particular, ill health is damaging labour supply. If the government is not prepared to raise the required taxes, it should be honest about that. Letting inflation reduce real pay, while expecting services to be maintained, let alone improve, is plainly dishonest.
The government should keep pay in line with the private sector’s, especially where it has significant recruitment and retention problems. If this means it has to reopen spending plans that no longer make sense in today’s debased pounds, so be it. What is happening now may be penny-wise, but it is pound-foolish."
It’s 3.50am. I got up because I couldn’t sleep. Reading that has done the trick. I'm back off to bed now. Thanks and goodnight.
Mostly job cuts but also the train driver will have additional work / more accountability for no extra pay.
If they go driver only trains it won't be long after that the trains driverless
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Why can't we just bring some common sense to the table & thrash out these problems in an adult, non political way.
A priority would be this one . . . .
www.bbc.co.uk
A priority would be this one . . . .
Hospitals in England pay £5,200 for one agency doctor's shift
Figures obtained by Labour through Freedom of Information requests reveal staff pressures in the NHS.
www.bbc.co.uk
The problem you mention is under resourcing of the NHS due to persistent and deliberate underfunding despite increasing demands from our ageing population whose health declines and whose needs grow.
It's crazy that a party dominated by elderly members cuts the sevices that keep them walking on this earth. I suppose they'd rather keep their money than their lives.
That would make a good slogan for a bus.
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It might still be possible for a “de facto general strike” to happen if enough industries succeeded in bringing industrial action at the same time. But union representation in the UK since the winter of discontent in 1978 and 1979 has fallen significantly, from about 50% in 1979 to about 23% in 2021, although it is still about 50% in the public sector. The reality of the 1979 comparison is made clear in Richard Partington’s piece from 8 December, which points out that while the number of working days lost this year could reach 1.74m, in September 1979 alone, 12m days were lost.
Critics of striking workers often present their pay demands as excessive in a time of economic difficulty. But in this analysis from July, Ashley Kirk sets out Office for National Statistics data that shows real public sector pay has fallen by 4.3% since the 2009 financial crisis. Meanwhile, the IFS says, real private sector pay has risen by 4.3% since 2010. New analysis published by the TUC today says that 2022 has been the worst year for real pay growth for almost 50 years.
Pay demands should also be set against the impact of inflation, which is quickly eroding the value of even generous-sounding settlements. For example, an offer to rail workers described as “8%” in a Daily Telegraph headline on 4 December is spread over two years, making it 4% in reality, against the most recent inflation figure of 11.1%.
On Thursday, the FT reported that employers had planned to offer the RMT a 10% pay rise over two years, only for the government to intervene. The eventual offer was 8% over two years, tied to the introduction of driver-only trains. That was not denied by the Department for Transport, while the FT quotes an “industry figure” as calling the intervention a “clumsy mis-step” that exacerbated the situation.
Last week, a YouGov poll found that only 37% of people supported striking rail workers, against 51% opposed. But an Observer poll found 40% blaming the government and rail companies, with 37% holding unions responsible – and also showed big majorities supporting nurses.
Factcheck: @TheGuardian.com
Critics of striking workers often present their pay demands as excessive in a time of economic difficulty. But in this analysis from July, Ashley Kirk sets out Office for National Statistics data that shows real public sector pay has fallen by 4.3% since the 2009 financial crisis. Meanwhile, the IFS says, real private sector pay has risen by 4.3% since 2010. New analysis published by the TUC today says that 2022 has been the worst year for real pay growth for almost 50 years.
Pay demands should also be set against the impact of inflation, which is quickly eroding the value of even generous-sounding settlements. For example, an offer to rail workers described as “8%” in a Daily Telegraph headline on 4 December is spread over two years, making it 4% in reality, against the most recent inflation figure of 11.1%.
On Thursday, the FT reported that employers had planned to offer the RMT a 10% pay rise over two years, only for the government to intervene. The eventual offer was 8% over two years, tied to the introduction of driver-only trains. That was not denied by the Department for Transport, while the FT quotes an “industry figure” as calling the intervention a “clumsy mis-step” that exacerbated the situation.
Last week, a YouGov poll found that only 37% of people supported striking rail workers, against 51% opposed. But an Observer poll found 40% blaming the government and rail companies, with 37% holding unions responsible – and also showed big majorities supporting nurses.
Factcheck: @TheGuardian.com
latest polls show 52% support nurses strikes
So you think 52% is "few people" -youve spent the last 6 years saying the opposite
Should nurses be allowed to go on strike?
In principle, do you think people in the following roles should or should not be allowed to go on strike? Nurses
yougov.co.uk
where on earth did all those EU doctors and nurses go...oh thats right they forked off back to EU as Filly and Mottie made them unwelcomeWhy can't we just bring some common sense to the table & thrash out these problems in an adult, non political way.
A priority would be this one . . . .
Hospitals in England pay £5,200 for one agency doctor's shift
Figures obtained by Labour through Freedom of Information requests reveal staff pressures in the NHS.
I believe the UK rail network hasnt got the infrastructure to do that automation would cost many billions
thus the idea of driverless trains is a non starter -and where they do have driverless trains on the few routes set up, they have qualified driver manning them
(I heard this in an interview, not researched it myself, so consider above opinion only)
It's not just doctors. Throw in bank nurses and also people in all areas of the NHS - back office jobs etc. Temp jobs can become near permanent.
Policy figures in some current NHS problems
Hospital beds in the UK 2000-2021 | Statista
The number of hospital beds in the United Kingdom has undergone a decline since the year 2000.
www.statista.com
Another source that has been updated
The number of hospital beds for general and acute care has fallen by 44 per cent since 1987/88; the bulk of this fall is due to closures of beds for the long-term care of older people. Medical innovation, including an increase in day-case surgery, has also had an impact by reducing the time that many patients spend in hospital.
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As bed numbers have fallen, England’s population has grown, from around 47.3 million in 1987 to approximately 56.6 million in 2020.
NHS hospital bed numbers
The number of hospital beds in England has more than halved over the past 30 years. This explainer looks at data on hospital beds, explores the drivers underpinning the changes it shows, and considers whether further reductions to bed numbers are realistic.
in January 2020, for example, the equivalent of 5,200 beds – 5 per cent of the total available acute and general beds – were being used by patients whose discharge had been delayed.
Not as many as some might think. It fits in with when the news broadcasts chats in a hospital and the number of patients that could be discharged and aren't get mentioned. Bed counts according to population in other countries is interesting as well, LOL Boris has said we need more hospitals in real terms that is the crux of the problem.
The care sector including day visits and residental. Personal experience of that with my mother.
Maybe some landlords fancy a change of business model. Also geriatric hospitals and I'll tell you something a fair number in those get treated and go home.
